14-09-2015 08:35 AM
14-09-2015 08:35 AM
14-09-2015 05:30 PM
14-09-2015 05:30 PM
Hey there @Misty-Mirrors,
Thanks for contributing to the forum,
Just to let you be aware that i believe this post is borderline inappropriate for this particular forum.
Its ok for any one to have religion but this forum is for discussions and support about mental health journey's- carers and people who experience mental health issues.
Kind regards,
Baboo
Sane Moderator
14-09-2015 05:47 PM
14-09-2015 05:47 PM
Thank you for your essay or poem Misty. I believe that compassion is a huge key to positive outcomes for the world.
Your post covers so much of the difficult part of your journey of life into and through adulthood. So many aspects of the Christian story and Christian tradition are powerful metaphors with the capacity to help us bear pain and suffering if used for good.
I have heard and seen many unjust things happen in the workforce and in various social groups so I am no longer surprised at the human capacity for betrayal and self advancement. Sorry you endured all that.
In my mid 20s I was studying Psychoanalysis and Social Theory, and then did a few years of Psychodrama which has lot to say about role and group theory, so I tend to view many therapuetic and religious phenomena through those lenses. It is a long time ago and I am no academic but also had 2 parents who suffered from persecutory and religious delusions and were diagnosed schizophrenic when I was a small child. I suffered from some of their extremism but also wanted to understand why they were the way they were. I am wary of dogmatism but also have experienced redemptive mystical experiences so I try not to judge. We all come to beliefs through our unique blend of experience.
I understand that identification with Jesus is important as a symbol and mix of everyman/woman and the divine or creative forces. We can immerse ourselves in a spiritual and very rich history narrative in order to bolster our confidence to carry us through adversity and difficulty.
The kind of theologians i like are Hans Kung, Henri Nouwen, George Worgul, and Mary Hunt. I would like to read Ilio Delio and more but my understandings are probably quite heretical although i do not mean to be blasphemous.
My father repeated something quite "unusual" when I was about 8 years old we lived in the parish of St Mary's Cathedral Sydney. He would lift me up and carry me down the aisle during the Offertory saying I was the "Body of Christ". I knew it was odd and I struggled to get down and usually managed to get away before he got to the altar ... eventually the cardinal asked us to leave and attend the little chapel near Kings Cross. It was a strong theological lesson for me though .. I interpret it as my father's confused love for me .. but I always knew I was not Jesus so I never entered those kinds of confused states of mind myself. I have thought I was "singular", "unusual", a person with a mission etc but not had a complete blurring of ego boundaries with a sainted or celebrity figure. I also did math science as a child so tended to be analytical.
The portuguese have a saying about life being pain ... I see the christian tradition as one way of looking at that kind of thing. I hope nothing I have written offentds you .. I am just trying to dialogue from my experience.
Regards Appleblossom
15-09-2015 05:10 PM
15-09-2015 05:10 PM
This is a bit random and probably not all that helpful, but anyway...
I have had some run ins with authority figures myself. If I feel misunderstood I just immediately get frustrated. I find it really hard to express myself to them eloquently when I am feeling scrutinised and misrepresented - I want to put my position forward rationally but my emotions overwhelm me. I try to catch my composure, stop myself from shaking and crying, and gather my words - unfortunately this gives them time to reiterate their point of view over and over again. When they do this it drowns out MY words in my head that I'm forming and causes me to be even more frustrated and emotional.
Over time this pattern has made me feel on edge when dealing with anyone who has any authority over me. The stress response starts with the release of cortisol in the brain when you perceive a threat - in this case I guess the threat is them trying to insinuate that I am one thing that I am not, which insults me and upsets me. Once the cortisol is released it's harder to control my body. My body literally wants to GET OUT of there. But I can't as they have control of the situation. So I feel powerless and frustrated and this turns on the child who cries and feels misunderstood. It's really horrible actually. I can go home and explain what happened and my position to my friends and family, but at the time, I'm a bloody mess. I LOOK insane. I can understand why they think that I am. But really I'm not. It's just a habitual thing that happens over time and your body starts to pre-empt it.
15-09-2015 06:33 PM - edited 15-09-2015 06:57 PM
15-09-2015 06:33 PM - edited 15-09-2015 06:57 PM
Sorry @Misty-Mirrors as I encouraged you to post and if you feel upset by the mod @Baboo's comment.
I did not see you as proselytising in the least but sharing your journey in your work and in your values, which happened to include religious concepts. I am totally fine with that. I dont really have Catholic beliefs as such but a great deal of catholic and christian experience .... thats me and I know other people are different ... thats been clear to me for a long time. Religion certainly helped my mother survive, even if I felt a bit abused by it ... but you @Misty-Mirrorshad already acknowledged that.
I think beliefs are mental constructs and as such have a huge relationship to mental illness ... religions are shared mental constructs and churches have a huge impact on history and society and have a few good protocols in their social teachings. COMPASSION being a key one. Not to be able to mention or tease out these issues would be counterproductive for any forum on mental illness. It was key to my childhood experiences. I would reject most vehemently to not being able to discuss it.
I am very glad @Baboo did not remove your post. As a poem it should be able to stand. We can rabbit on about Mindfulness and thats ok ... but some of the esoteric practices which birthed the concept of mindfulness are in the realm of mysticism or superstition.
These days christianity is out of fashion with many therapists but yoga and Buddhism are "in". SSo we can rabbit on about Mindfulness til the cows come home. I am into mindfulness and have been for 30 years I find it amusing that it is now everywhere toted as the great saviour of mental illnesss ...
Hi @DefiantPanda I think compassion is very important when a person is so stressed and has all those physiological symptoms you described when you deal with authority. Compassion just means ... with feeling ... sharing feeling ... sharing understanding ... etc The thing that cured me most from those feelings being triggered by authority figures was being in a position of authority myself. It can be hard. I still get all those feelings and symptoms when experiencing conflict. The truth is that EVERYBODY does if they are open .. it is just a question of number of supports and how often exposed to such stresses etc. Accumulation of it too often has devastating effects like we on the forum experience one way or another.
I tend to think in more pop-medico style like you rather than religious ... but I had access to those concepts, my parents did not. It is partly a generation thing, but I also know devout young people.
I could not say the God word without putting in an extra "O" and turning it into good. I could not say the prayer word though meditation was fine ... and eventually I developed a contemplative style ... a bit of mash up of the French abbeys and the buddhist daikinis and yogis andFreud and Jung etc etc etc and I guess the baldy Yul Brynner from the King and I.
Social Justice messages mean a lot to me .. so I overlook aspects of faith traditions I do not believe in and Yul in real life would be a pain in the bum.
We can rabbit on n we We are allowed to We cSoan yadda yadda about mindfulness til the cows come home.
15-09-2015 06:55 PM
15-09-2015 06:55 PM
It can be a bit cold at times being a mod- its my job to remind people of the rules as well as be encouraging and as least offensive as you can be...
15-09-2015 08:30 PM
15-09-2015 08:30 PM
Sorry @Baboo I am usually supportive of good people in authority .. I was trying to broaden things out to include berspectives of both posters. Thats my defense against narrow minded anything.
Lack of compassion seems growing with some of the shaming cultures on the web these days. This forum is a much needed site. The behind the scenes moderation seems to be effective.
16-09-2015 11:10 AM
16-09-2015 11:10 AM
16-09-2015 04:45 PM
16-09-2015 04:45 PM
I found your piece interesting. Especially, the way you interspersed lines from your own experience into iconic aspects of Jesus' narrative.
Some people find religous words confronting others are offended if you dont use them ...we cant pleez all the people allthe time. I grew up in a family divided into atheists and churchy types. My father was deeply religious, grew up in ST V's orphanage so didnt have much choice. He also studied philosophy and history at Melb uni and was in the ALP .. I dont think he would have been dogmatic, he put my mother on a pedestal. He didnt live long enough and I wasnt really allowed to talk to him by (my mother) to find out. The main weird thing he did was the walk with his kids down the aisle during the offertory procession.
Any way one of those theologians I mentioned has written an interesting book called From Magic to Metaphor. I see your piece as a poem about identiication and passing through many aspects of life.
17-09-2015 05:00 PM
17-09-2015 05:00 PM
Thanks for sharing @Misty-Mirrors It's an insightful analogy.
I don't think I've seen you on the Forums since July or so 🙂 It's nice to have you around again 🙂
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